E208 Kiki Athanas

Hello, my name is Aziz, and I'm the son of a divorce mother. She is really my superhero. That's why it's important for me to support women, to share their uniqueness, their personalities, perspectives, and emotions about this world. In these difficult times in human history, we need to bring the people of the world together. And when we hear the voices of women, when we listen to real lives of women from other countries, we connect our cultures without differences or stereotypes. And we get inspired by their stories to live a better life. That's what this podcast is all about. My guest today is Kiki Athanas. Kiki specializes in working with professional women to free themselves from emotional eating and non-stop thinking about food. Kiki loves wellness, fashion, travel, and everything that has to do with aesthetics. She has been living abroad for the past two years and has really loved immersing herself in the new culture of Mexico. Her heart lies in Europe, though, and she plans to relocate there very soon. Kiki has always loved health, but now she loves it more from a healthy place. Kiki, how are you today? I'm doing so good, and I'm so excited to be on this show, so thank you for having me. Thank you, Kiki. I'm excited to have you here, and absolutely curious about you as a person. You see him very interesting and had a colorful life, so I'll begin with this. If your friends could describe your personality, what would they say about you? Well, it's so funny that you asked that because years ago I was working with a coach, and she got me to ask that very question to my friends to sort of gain more perspective, right? I remember some of the key words were magnetic, which I thought was just so sweet, inspiring, happy, and I think it's nice to remember how your friends see you, and I hope that I come across as bubbly and energetic and someone that uplifts and brings positivity to the world, versus the opposite. Of course, I have my hard days, and I'm human, and we all have our ups and downs, but I would hope that most of my friends continue, even though that was years ago, to consider me to be an overall uplifting and positive person, not in a toxic positivity way, but in a really supportive, human way. Thank you, I love that answer, and I have so many follow-up questions related to that, but actually I'll begin with a different topic, because I believe it's very important to inspire women to find their courage, to go for their dreams, and we live in a time where maybe because of the pandemic and social isolation or social media or just the evolution of society. A lot of people, including women, they feel that they are stuck within their comfort zone, they fear the judgment of others. So how did you find the bravery to leave your country, go a globe trotting, and vagabonding all over the world, and go to a new culture like Mexico, which could be intimidating to many. So how did you find that courage, what beliefs did you have about the world, maybe life is too short, maybe you know, or I don't know what you think, that allows you to overcome any limitations and to dare go out of your comfort zone? Oh, well, I will give you a two-fold answer on that, because I can give you the super brave, kind of badass version, but I can also give you the possibly more truthful version, which was that I never felt like I needed to rip the band-aid off right away. Truth be told, I left Canada. I was in Toronto at the time, and I didn't actually think that I was quote-unquote moving. I had always wanted to escape Canadian winters. I do not like the cold, and I never will. I am not meant to be in a cold climate. So ever since I can remember, I always dreamt about living somewhere warm, and finally, I was able to kind of set up my life and my finances so that I could just sort of escape the winter, and that was honestly my only intention. I didn't even sublet my apartment. That was how sure I was that I would return to Toronto. I still wanted, you know, the exact same apartment with all of my furniture I didn't want, anyone even touching it, and so I never really had to rip off the band-aid. I got an Airbnb, and I was like, hey, I'll be back soon, and it was a slow progression where I decided, you know, what? I don't think I'm going to go back, and not to say that I didn't return since leaving to visit family and to reconnect with my life there. But that's oftentimes the advice that I give to women when they ask me, like, oh my goodness, how did you do it? And I'll tell them, I did it one step at a time. Like, you don't have to make this decision now to change everything in your life by tomorrow because that's scary. And if I would have done it in that way, I would have never done it. And so for me, I had to just take each little micro step at a time. But in terms of the kind of mindset shift that I had to make, which was really, really scary, was to actually want what I want, and this is something that I work on with clients. It was like kind of tapping into that selfishness of, you know what? Like, I want this, and that's enough. I don't have to prove, you know, my worthiness to anyone else. I don't have to defend my desires. I don't have to do everything that pleases everyone else. My dad is quite conservative, Greek, and so to him, it's not exactly his dream situation that his daughters in Mexico of all places right now. But I had to really own my own want and my own want at that time, and currently was and is to be in Mexico. And it's really a matter as being okay with wanting what you want. I agree 100%. And I'm curious, was this a journey where over time you discovered that you had this in you? Or are you born this way? Did you have like a rebels stubborn streak within you that evolved and continued to grow over time? But it's part of you since you are a little girl? Or were you more shy, introverted, and less daring? But then over time, like you said, bite in the elephant, one bite at a time in order to eat it, you became more and more confident and able to live with courage. So funny, you say the word rebel. I would never describe myself in that way. And I still don't feel like I'm living in a way that's super rebellious or even unique. Because to be honest, I feel like I'm quite conservative. I always joke that I'm very vanilla. I follow the rules. I've never been one to just be like, oh, I'm just going to do it my way. And who cares? I do have that streak of kind of people pleasing within me. I've always been to be honest, you know, social validation, you know, whether it be as a child from my parents or teachers or whatever, I've always just wanted to do things in the right way and gain approval. And so I've ultimately found my way to kind of balance those things of sort of wanting to be a bee booblyzer, but then also wanting to please myself. And I think that it has been a very gradual shift. There was never like one day or one year that everything turned around. I think it's just ultimately becoming more and more comfortable and confident in myself. And that doesn't mean that you have to, again, rip off the band-aid or be like, oh, whatever, I'm just going to do up my way and who cares. I think you can be a conscious creator and still consider having your needs met. And if those needs include having everyone else's needs met too, it's finding the balance within that. And ultimately reminding yourself and definitely reminding myself that the more that I give to my own happiness, ultimately those that I care for and that care for me become happy too, right? And it's sort of like seeing the bright side of being selfish. Thank you. I love that answer. It's very inspiring, I hope. And I know a lot of women when listening, they will find a lot of value and inspiration in that. And to ask you a bit more, you mentioned that you got your finances in order before moving away. What are some lessons that maybe if you were early on thinking about starting your journey of traveling, experiencing other cultures as a woman, you wish someone would have told you about starting an online business? What are some myths or things that were unexpected that you discovered or things you believed that were wrong that when you understood you were able to thrive more? Maybe you can share it with some new entrepreneurs who are female and wanting to dominate the world and have their independence and freedom, and therefore they can avoid some missteps thanks to your advice. Oh, I love that question. I think the biggest shift for me was really surrounding myself with other people, even if it was virtually who were doing what I wanted to do. And intentionally removing myself from those that were doubters, although no one meant any harm, I'm sure, but it was really being conscious to not hang out or at least not let the people that sort of don't understand the world of entrepreneurship, being a digital nomad, the people that really didn't get that, and we're going to kind of poo-poo it. I made sure that I wouldn't bring up those sorts of topics with them because I didn't want to be negatively influenced or I didn't want them to kind of discourage me because I do know that I am quite, I don't want to say oblivious, but I am very easily influenced. And so I tried to use that as my superpower versus, you know, a constraint. And so I joined various masterminds. I did hire a coach and not to say that you have to invest in a coach. I think there's this whole kind of side of Instagram or social media right now that it's like, oh, if you don't invest in yourself or your career or whatever, then you're not going to do well. And I don't believe in that either. For me, a coach was really helpful because it was someone that really led the way and essentially was able to kind of pick me up in those hard times and remind me that it's like, no, you're doing this. And, you know, I've done it. I have other clients who have done it and, you know, you're not a special unicorn that can't, you can too. And so I would say if you can find a mentor or a friend or some sort of community that is going to show you that it's real and that it's possible because ultimately if you believe it, then that's the truth. And for a lot of us, we have to overcome who we were and that includes the community that we were in in order to be who we want to be. And that sometimes means leaving certain people behind or at least in certain ways. And I think that was the main shift for me. It was really adopting a new identity and that also means letting go of your old one. I love that you're speaking in a way that has a lot of psychological wisdom and self-development and size that come from reality. So to ask you even further, why choosing nutrition, relationship with food, et cetera, especially that before you were involved in more aesthetic and design and all kinds of other fields, what attracted you to this? Is it something that your story is manifested and was very affected by food and relationship to food and weight loss? Or is it something that you found that you can help people most with? And it's your gift? Or what was going on with that decision? Well, I think that a lot of wellness practitioners, because now I work with quite a few, we often teach what we've had to heal within ourselves. And for me, food was always kind of the elephant in the room. I had always struggled with this obsession with eating, with an auditing. It felt like food consumed my life. And when I found, finally found freedom from that. And again, found health from an approach and in an energy that felt a lot healthier versus restrictive and rule-based, it really did set me free. And it allowed me to move forward in a way that I feel aligned. So for me, to be honest, food was always my dirty little secret, even when I was in the wellness world. And people were looking up to me, like, I was this healthy wellness expert deep down. I was mentally struggling, because I was so obsessed with what I should be eating, what I shouldn't be eating. And I'm really thankful for all of that craziness now, because I have such a deeper awareness of intuitive eating. And what it really does mean to be healthy. And the more I learn about that and the more I experience that, the more I realize that it's less about the dogmatic approach of nutrition, so to speak, but it's more about ultimately being happy. And when we're happy and when we're in alignment, we're going to make, quote unquote, nutritious choices because we care for ourselves, right? And we're coming from a place of love. And I believe that we need to, we don't necessarily need to understand more about the details of macros, but more so, you know, how can we connect with the feeling inside of our body and the visceral sensations inside of our stomach and our gut so that we can make these kind, nutritious choices from a place of, again, love. And I know that that sounds kind of fluffy. And, you know, I mean it from a very practical standpoint, I don't just mean it in this vague, like, oh, we just need to love ourselves way. But truly getting back to that self connection and that connection within our gut, which holds our core identity and the more that we connect with that, the less that nutrition is important. And the more that nutrition becomes natural. And something that we enjoy versus something that we sort of have to check off or to do this. Thank you. I love that. And actually it's a very important part of your life that can create and induce a lot of stress and therefore relieving it and fixing it and having a healthy relationship with it has a huge effect on a person's psyche. And I'm very curious about your experience as someone helping women all over the world with this. You are located in Mexico, are most of your clients to maybe expats or locals from Mexico, where you can sometimes have meetups with them? Or is it virtual and many of them? They're from Europe and North America? More, I mean, of course, Mexico is North America, but I mean, like Canada, the U.S. Or what kinds of women seem to gravitate towards you and your vibe and your energy most? Oh, that's an interesting question. You know what? I have had the pleasure of working with women from all across the world, including even Australia, which to be honest is sometimes a bit of a challenge in terms of scheduling because it means that one of us has to see each other either really early in the morning or late at night. But I actually, I always work with clients virtually through Zoom. And so I've worked with clients all across North America, Europe. It really is a global issue, but I would say that most of my clients are from Canada or the U.S. I think to be honest, is that Europe has a slightly better relationship to food, especially if you look at places like France, you know, Greece, like it's, they really do appreciate the stopping to eat and having eating and food occasions, being this sacred pause in the movement of life versus North America, we really have been trained in condition to kind of multitask and, oh, snacks, snacks, snack, eating on the go. And I think that there's no coincidence that most of my clients are from that part of the world where there is this, you know, hustle culture and food is just another thing to get done, to check off the list, to do while you're doing something else versus in a place like, again, you know, I mentioned France, where it's more of the culture to sit down, to stop what you're doing, to pause, to eat foods that taste good for you, not that are just, you know, labeled as quote unquote, healthy for the sake of being healthy. So yeah. Thank you. That's really, really interesting and so true and goes counter to a lot of the narrative in society, but yes, you spoke about Italy, maybe for example, as part of Europe and an interview, an Italian model who enjoys food and is a foodie and people always ask her, how can you stay thin while you're eating in the Italian food? And to her, she said this about the energy if the food is made with love by hand and you have put your soul into it, it will for sure be nutritious to those receiving it rather than fat and ink and dead and ink. So that was interesting. And I'm curious as a coach and I know about coaches, not specifically in your field, but more therapy or coaches that are life coaches, how do you deal and maintain your energy? Because with every meeting or every coaching session with someone that you have, you are given a part of yourself to them. And when they speak about their problems, there is some transfer of their negative energy towards you a little bit contaminating a little bit of your psyche. How do you deal with that? How do you keep your energy high? If people are sat in it all day long, almost. And if people are complaining, how do you not get affected? But that barrage of negativity where some people could be in a state where they're desperate and really, really in a bad place, expressive that and communicating that energetically. You know, before I did this work, I had a lot of friends that were coaches and they would speak about this. And so to be honest, I was a little bit nervous about it, but I genuinely and I'm not just saying this to pretend like, ah, everything's great. My clients do not suck my energy because I genuinely love what I'm doing. If I were to relate this or compare this to when I was doing other work in the wellness world that was sometimes draining, going on different calls with, you know, my employers, etc. Yeah. Like in terms of energy management, you know, I would have to really space out calls. I would have to make sure that I was giving myself a proper, you know, time to self-care and come back to equilibrium between calls. But I can genuinely say that my calls now, even if it's with women that are really in the thick of their struggles, it doesn't suck me dry at all. And I think it's because my approach is really about helping women to move forward. I'm not really about, oh, let's dig up your childhood trauma and dissect everything so that we can figure everything out so that you can heal. I'm more so about like, okay, let's move forward. How can we give you some strategies so that you can really make better decisions in the moment and then create a momentum for you feeling better in the long term too. And so I'd like to think that all of my clients come out of our calls feeling inspired and at a more peaceful place. And that if anything, it gives me more energy. Sometimes when I do have later client calls in the evening due to, you know, certain timing kind of time zone things going on, I literally can't go to sleep afterwards because it lights me on fire. I love it. And I think the takeaway from all of that is if what you're doing doesn't energize you, then change what you're doing. 100% that's perfect advice. And to know you even more because you're a very bubbly person and someone with magnetic energy and all that, where do you believe that energy comes from? I mean, I'm speaking in a more about spirituality or maybe in a metaphysical way or maybe it's about nutrition. Do you feel that it's the food that you eat because you love it? That gives you the energy that you have? Is it because you're in love with life? And that gives you passion and enthusiasm? Or do you feel and believe maybe you are following your destiny and purpose and therefore your infused with the energy of the gods, like the Greek gods and therefore that's why you have the magnetic positive energy? Or in general, people who want to be more positive like you and have a high level of energy, what did you do? Maybe it was unconscious? What would be your advice to them? And where in your mind, do you feel that energy comes from? Like I said, is it food? Is it being on your purpose and path? Or is it simply passion for what you do? Or something else that you might have in mind? Ooh, what a good question. And as an intuitive eating coach, I will say 100%, it is not from food. I will say energy comes from your thoughts and the more that you catch any sort of thoughts that are out of alignment, I call them non-value-based beliefs, beliefs essentially that don't feel super true for you, the more that you let those run the show, so to speak. I think that's how your energy is drained and how you can maybe start to feel not so great. And when I think about my own experiences, when I didn't really feel, as you say, an alignment on your path in your purpose, you know, when I wasn't in that zone, my thoughts also weren't happy or inspiring or at least supportive of where I really wanted to go. So I think whether you're in a rat or whether you're in a good place, it's really about catching the thoughts. And I always often tell my clients, catch the thoughts. First thing in the morning, are you worried about something that's going to happen? Are you sad about something that has happened? And how can you bring yourself into the now? And definitely it's still a practice for myself included, but really coming into the present, and you know, feeling into the current moment, so that you can adjust accordingly. And that doesn't mean being like overly happy all of the time, but it means being comfortable in the now. And I think that's really what can be so energizing. I remember reading a study around, I think it was like employee productivity or something like that. And they were actually saying how even if your employees are like, I guess not satisfied with the work, a tip that you can give them is to just have them actually be more present with the work that they're doing. Essentially, it was proven that if you don't like something or if you find something boring, if you just actually do it more mindfully and sort of, you know, without distractions and be more present to it, you'll enjoy it more, which sounds so counterintuitive. It's like, if I don't like something, how is doing it more intentionally going to make it better? But it's actually so true. Once you just surrender to the present moment, be it good or bad, things become easier and you do get energized. So I'd also like to think that the Greek gods are with me too sure. I loved your approach to that. But I think ultimately my answer would be it comes from our thoughts. Thank you. I love that answer and it's absolutely and positively true. And now since two things, one, you are in a foreign land, in a foreign place, relying on yourself and building your future that puts you into an introspective state as well as dealing with your coaching clients all the time. And recently we had a period of new year resolutions. Is there a lesson or something that you have learned that you want to add more to your life or to eliminate from your life or something that to live more in alignment with that you had as a more recent realization that you can share with other women who might benefit and find it to be valuable, exciting, inspiring, and insightful? Oh yes, I will. Share something quite personal actually, which is I really want to add more structure and security to my life, specifically around financial savings. I've always been fairly good at making money, to be honest. And I've always been very comfortable making scary investments. And I always felt like saving is for boring people. Like investing is in terms of long-term investing. That's for people that it's like, oh, that's so boring. And I just want to live life in the now and live good. And I'm right now in a place where I'm ready to invite in more of that boring, beautiful, you know, saving, investing, structured energy, especially as it relates to my finances. So I'm learning more about what that means, what that looks like, and kind of battling the fears that I have around that and realizing that it's like, I don't have to be an expert in it. Like, I can hire, you know, financial support and help and people that do understand the world in that way and markets. And again, you know, accounting and all of those things. And it doesn't mean that I have to be perfect in it. I just have to be open to accepting help. And so I think that's what I'm inviting more into my life for 2023 is feeling financially stable, which I'm realizing that I used to look at in like a negative way for some reason. And I'm trying to shift that narrative and see it as an exciting thing to be, you know, financially stable. And I'm trying to see the excitement and the joy in that versus sort of the, the, uh, ness that I used to see that world in. I agree 100%. And since we're speaking about finances, let's say there are some women who feel inspired by your story. They want to reach out to you. They want to learn more about how you can help them. Of course, I'll make sure to write your Instagram as well as your website and the episode description. But how can you help them? What do you do these days? And where best can they learn more and find more about you? Thank you for asking. Yes, I would love to connect with any of your listeners. Um, be it for my work with, um, eating issues. So essentially for any women struggling with any form of disordered eating. I have a program called Mind Body Beauty where I take women through my gut brain integration method. That's on my website, kiki at ness.com. But also just to connect with your community. And, you know, if people have questions about moving to Mexico or anything like that, I'm totally an open book. And I would love to connect. And so thank you so much for, um, you know, opening up your platform to share my story. You are welcome. It was my honor and my privilege to have you here today. Thank you.