E006 Alyona Zhyvkova

Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 0:00 your femininity is powerful in all its forms exceptional women, rare girls must be appreciated in every way. From their perspectives, actions, thoughts, and their unique ways of being. Such rare girls are inspiring. And this is what this podcast is all about. Hello, my name is Aziz and my guest today is Alyona Zhyvkova, the international curvy model, social media influencer and proud Ukrainian Eliana, how are you today? Alyona Zhyvkova 0:49 Hello. I don't know when I was in give I used to answering this question on the Live. Today I answer. All right. Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 1:01 What emotionally changed that change your answer? What does it mean? What's the difference between both? Alyona Zhyvkova 1:09 I'm not under bombing anymore. So. And I cannot say that I'm doing good or well, so I just chose to say, I'm alright. Yes, I'm doing okay. I keep leaving. And yeah, I don't know. It's very hard times. Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 1:35 It's very traumatic. I remember also, when I was in Kyiv, when there was all those bombings and air raid sirens and uncertainty and there was a mix of real danger and seeing the destruction and knowing all the suffering created, as well as understanding the nature of life that really even when it's not war, we don't know what will happen next. We can be in danger or not at any moment, I'm not aware of it. So war in many ways, remind us that life is precious, and that control is an illusion. What are your thoughts about this? Alyona Zhyvkova 2:20 I'm sorry. I just got emotional. I'm, honestly, I'm not sure what to enter on your question. Exactly. But I'm having like, all types of thoughts in my head right now. About how war changed perspect perspective on a lot of things. So definitely cannot say that. I can be positive at the moment, or optimistic. By the way, did you know that people who survived the war usually are not optimistic people? Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 3:01 You're mean, they don't be they become less optimistic because of it, or the people who are not so optimistic survive more than others? Alyona Zhyvkova 3:12 Yeah, people who like imagine the worst happening are the one who actually able to take actions because when you're too optimistic, you're sort of lying to yourself that everything is gonna be alright. And eventually you can end up being captured or simply die. Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 3:35 I agree. I actually one of the reasons I stayed longer than I used to during the war there is that I didn't really believe it was possible in 2022, to have that war. And I remember I read there was a journalist who spent time in many wars and his recommendation was, it doesn't get better. So make sure to stay safe and leave as soon as possible not wait for the next day or the day after. So you're very correct. How did it change you as a person, this experience of the war and everything? Alyona Zhyvkova 4:16 You know, I loved our previous podcast, but I felt like I knew the answers right now. It feels like I don't know the answers for anything. That's how it changed me. I I don't feel safe anymore. I don't feel happy anymore. Feel more depressed. I feel very desperate at the moments. Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 4:45 I agree. I mean, I wish it were under better circumstances and we know each other for a while and I noticed the difference and evolution. Did you notice some belief or connection to human Nature by seeing all the people who are helping, whether in all parts of Europe or in Italy, or anywhere in the world, and are with the Ukraine and the Ukrainian people and people who are evacuating, do you feel touched, because of this, or negativity so strong that it's not even possible to notice or to appreciate or anything like that? Alyona Zhyvkova 5:31 No, I appreciate a lot of things. And I see how people united, and I'm so proud to be Ukrainian right now. And I have to say that I've been proud to be Ukrainian before. I love my country. I love my city. I love my people. I know a lot of people was like, running away from Ukraine, even before, it was like, blaming all their life on Ukraine. And I sort of understand them, but at the same time, people is what make the country so yeah, they're just the responsible infantile people who need to educate themselves a little more. But at the same time, it's just human beings, I understand them, because we all tend to be weak sometimes. And about the European people who help a lot is this is so precious. And I was hosted by the by the guy and his mom and dad at their home. And they are not even volunteers. Like, they're not even the part of those people who take who shelter people. By the choice, it's just that I knew someone who knew this person, and who let me stay there for just one night in this woman. When I was showing my gratitude to her she say like, well, you would do the same. And I was like, Yeah, of course, we will do the same. Maybe not in such a good houses and apartments. But yeah, we would do the same. Definitely. Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 7:24 I remember also one of the things that makes Europeans be so generous, and so caring is that they can feel it could be us at any moment. So it's, in a way, a deep connection, because it touches them personally. And I also have a friend and she's graduated, and she was planning to leave Ukraine and live abroad. But now she refuses to do that. She said before, before I can choose to live abroad. Now I am forced to and I refuse that I stay in my home and in my country. So I understand what you're saying. How do you distract yourself from all the stress and all the negativity and worry, so that you can have a little bit of emotional stability and mental health? Alyona Zhyvkova 8:20 So what are you saying about the people who are like, leaving or staying, even my brother who left in 2016 and was living in LA, Los Angeles, America, states since 2016, and who he was like, he experienced something and not nice in Ukraine, and he was like, he didn't ever want to return it and I was very surprised by it. But when the war started, he suddenly became a very proud American, sorry, Ukrainian and he like supports all the way and he even told me like, Okay, I had my difficulties was expressing that before but right now, like I truly understand that I am Ukrainian and I wish I was there to help anyhow and he supports and each way he can be even collected some money it was there a dense community there in LA, I think something around $50,000 which is like great amount to buy some equipment and or some medicine for the volunteer groups who can give it to people in need. And your question was, how do I keep saying basically, in this war well I remember on the day nine, I think, or eight when I was in queue, that's when I really started to give up. And I really got in a very dark space in my head. And it really scared me, I felt like I'm falling too far too deep, too down. And I was like, Okay, I need to do something. So I believe that life is movement. And if you stuck somewhere, and you don't know how to get out, you just need to keep moving. You just need to do some things and be small, something big, even just the wall up if you can do that, or something, you just need to do something. So what I do right now is just try to leave the normal lives in southern safe in Milan, Italy right now. So yeah, Mike your is movement, and routine, let's say that, and of course, talking to people, but but not for me about the war. Because when you're alone, and you have your phone in your hands, all you do is read the news. Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 11:20 I know it's horrible, because if you don't follow the news, there is a sense of guilt, that you're not like keeping aware of everything. But if you do it, it messes the mental health. And you said you're speaking to people in Italy. And I know how much you kind of get in touch and analyze people's psychology. How do you compare Italian people and Ukrainians and everybody that you're meeting? Maybe the people from Dubai that you are involved with before? Do you notice a difference? Or is everybody trying to be kind and helpful because of the situation in Ukraine. So it's not so much about understanding differences in people and culture and personality? Alyona Zhyvkova 12:14 Well, what I said is better not to talk about the war. But touch also other topics, not only the war, and you say that you feel guilty if you don't read the news for me, I feel not in control. If I don't read the news, I remember the far I was from the hotspot from from the Bombay from the air raid alerts, the more I felt, the less I felt out of control. And in Yes, I felt the more guilt. So when I don't read the news. I feel like I may miss something. It's something that I feel guilty when I don't read the news. It's like, who's like I may miss something in. So yeah, first few weeks, it was like, the news was my food is like a good. Like, it felt like I don't breathe if I don't read the news, because it was too important. But at the same time, what's gonna, what's going to happen if I miss one day of the news, right? But it's just this ephemera feeling. And talking about the people in Italy Well, I have some Ukrainian friends here. So we were talking about how to get the temporary protection here how to be illegal here how to start work and with some guerrilla was even discussing voice so yeah, I cannot say that. It can be totally wiped off the floor of the conversations. And I was talking to one Italian girl who has a brand here. And she even gifted me the belt that she sends me before for the ad. And I never got it because I was supposed to get it on 24th February, to give to give to me the same. And she even got on the photoshoot with me. Of course I'm not gonna charge the money for it. Because she's such a precious girl and she actually didn't speak a world word of war. Till like the very end of our meeting. She did a really good job of distracting me. We were just thinking about like, a life job modeling the being a female micro brand. CEO owner. Yeah, definitely that there is Also one min here in the building where I leave, he's a manager. He also very helpful, but I remember the feeling when I just arrived to the Milan. And like people were careless, they seem to Carolyn, the they were just like living their normal lives and for me being just off Ukraine after three days on the way it was like, I just wanted to scream. I just wanted like, don't you know, there's more do something do something it felt like so weird for me to see people just leave their lives. And yeah, in Italy, like everywhere you go, there's always volunteers and something but but not only to people are kind but in they do help a lot. But the government is not it is not it, I think you cannot even get the same temporary protection here. As in France, for example, you don't get social help, you don't get work permission. All you get is like you've done everything, give it official paper to stay here over three months, they just told me like to come after three months to do the same procedure, I guess. And all I got is like medical help, like I can get any help, except for dentists. So yeah, that's it. I'm a bit disappointed with Italy. But why I came here is because it's efficient industry here. So I just hope I will get the job. And I don't want to go to Emirates for now because it's it feels too far from home. And I don't want that. And I don't I cannot go too far. For now. It's just like to be too harsh on myself. Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 17:11 Understand really every single thing you're saying and it's difficult situation, your situation. I'm thinking so many millions of Ukrainians left Ukraine, when hopefully the war ends, do you feel sure that a lot of them will return or Ukraine will lose a lot of people who can rebuild it who can do something wonderful because they have started a life abroad because even now, for example, Canada is offering the ability to move there for Ukrainians. Part of the UK, it's opening more and more. There is Spain, France, Germany, all that. Do you feel that there will be a huge patriotic wave When the war ends and all those millions of people will return for that the new life and stability compared to not knowing how Ukraine will be will stop many from returning? Alyona Zhyvkova 18:17 Well, for now, it's really hard to speak about it because like we still don't know what's going to happen, right? Like, I genuinely believe that Ukraine will win. But it's like, I can't see how the word how the horrible and any time so. So it's very hard to discuss it. But if to speak about my own statistic, and my people, my friends, I can say that everybody will return. I'm not like the refugee status is scaring me. I don't want people to take my passport for five years and take my ability to come back to my own country. Like, but I see the other side. I see the people who think that it's there like a ticket. But I think there's stupid not in a judging way. But I think they don't really understand what it's what ahead of them. Because I think an immigrant is forever immigrant. I don't mind to go live in New York for one year. I don't mind work around the world, but I always want to come back home. I always like I was actually planning to open my own brand of clothes of sport clothes in Ukraine. But yeah, I will do that as soon as I can come back. But I think even if though Those bright minds who leave Ukraine, they will still stay Ukrainians and we will be proud of them from afar. But I'm so sure that a lot of people will come back. Because you cannot take the home from people like, if we will have work to come back. Everyone will come back because it's our home. And then everyone who, who's who's certain about Ukraine? Who, who? Who got certain about Ukraine? So, yeah, there will be some percentage of people who will flee Ukraine and who will be like you, Ooh, I got what I wanted. But fuck them. I'm sorry. I don't know if you could sense or Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 20:54 on your border, expressing your emotions. They Alyona Zhyvkova 21:00 know, they know where their actual worship went. Anyway. Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 21:07 I understand. And I really hope many will return. I understand also, what you're saying about being a refugee forever. And since this podcast is about women and girls and all that, how do you feel about Ukrainian women and their contribution to the war efforts? Not only those who can be actively fighting, but all of them from all too young? Did you see anything that really warmed your heart? How do you perceive Ukrainian women? After you have seen what happened during the war, and after? Tell me more. Alyona Zhyvkova 21:52 I think Ukrainian women are very, very strong. I thought that before. And I think that's still because they're, of course, there's always different type of people, but between those who contribute themselves to help Ukraine and Ukrainian people are the strongest. And this is those who stayed there, either stay there and now or either doing something from afar or helping their inner circle. But I just think that Ukrainian women are very powerful and very tough, you know. So that toughness helped them. Sort of, during this war, I was actually even thinking to join the military forces. Like honestly, I was very clear one day that I want to go take the gun, take some training, if they accept me, and I was ready to go to the hotspots, I was ready to do that really. So I know people who was really scared and who will save in their lives and I think this is strong too. You have to you have to be able to do that because as I said some people are too optimistic and not always does a good job for them. It's almost like gaslighting yourself everything is gonna be alright. And like denying your own feelings the moment that you're actually feel scared or really don't feel Yeah, Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 23:43 that's interesting. You said people who guys like themselves like that don't survive the war. Alyona Zhyvkova 23:54 Yeah, that's exactly what I Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 23:59 do you know what will be your next plans or you'll just relax, find some stability, see what happens and then react based on what happens. Or like you said, it's Milano, you'll find some fashion work. You might start your brand there with Ukrainian roots and move with it because you said movement is how to overcome stagnation and depression or you'll just he'll walk in the spring nature to rebalance or what will you do? Alyona Zhyvkova 24:37 You know, I feel very lucky and very guilty at the same time because I felt like I was ready for this in a way that all my life was built around. Being abroad. But running away I felt like I felt so ready for this office. financially secured. I had a job abroad, I had, like, even my ex is from abroad. So my father is in Crimea, my brother is in America. I don't have a boyfriend and a key if it felt like, I'm good to go, you know, nothing is holding me, nothing is holding me except for more love to my country into my home. But I was I was actually preparing to get up on your own apartment in Kyiv. It's really sad, but at the same time, I remember I was staying in key for so long because I was saying like, I can leave any time any moment and I will be alright. Because this is the truth. Like there's no issue for me. And from thinking this way. My way to to beto he was quite easy. It was a little long, but it was quite easy. You know, it's, it's really arrogant to say this, but I made my way comfortable. And I was not looking for making a bad way. I feel so empathetic for people who were fleeing and trains and, and like leaving their homes. So fast without clothes and everything, without clothes without documents in like, you know, even without their animals. But I wasn't looking forward to panic and leave like that. For me it would be a very thought through action. As I did, like, I prepared myself to leave key for a couple of days and I got a 36 kg suitcase. I bought all the documents, I got all the savings. The only thing I left there is laptop. And I was like, Okay, I will leave something there. But yeah, I mean, I left also a lot of clothes. But it was my way of living in we found a car left with the family, but didn't have a car. But as I say like there's always a way I was not so I was leaving without that huge suitcase of mine. So I feel lucky. As I said before, because my job is also I can I can work pretty much anywhere. They want me. So I just hope I will get the job and Mulan closer to home. I have casting on Tuesday for quite a nice agency here. Now hopefully will be providing me with jobs. If no, I can always go to Emirates. It's just I feel sad because they didn't support Ukraine so much. I think they even started given the visa for Ukraine, even though it was visa free before entrance for Ukrainians to Emirates. So yeah, if I was if I will be feeling not so good. I can I can go to Emirates, or I can try to get American visa and go and try to work there. But for now, I just hope I can do that. In Europe closer to home and legally because I'm not trying to do anything illegal when the illegal immigrant or refugee. Yeah, so that's my answer. That's what I'm doing. That's my plan. I just, I rented the apartment here, and I'm looking forward to have some work and be alright. As I imagined that because as I said at the beginning, I felt like everything was settled for me even before which I feel very guilty for because me being lucky if they sway means that there's some unlucky person who's in Mariupol underbone being not even able not be not been able to even collect that 36 kg. Suitcase you know, so I rather cold call myself privileged but However, again, does that tell? Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 30:04 I really feel your situation? And I hope we'll speak again. And there are better circumstances and I wish you the best and to Ukraine as well. Good news soon. Thank you all, Jana. Thank you. Again. Alyona Zhyvkova 30:27 Thank you so much for having me. I'm sorry for making this podcast not about women, but about the war, but I feel like you just cannot take this topic of Ukrainian right now. Like, this is what I leave. And even being in peaceful Milan, but it is what it is. And I apologize, but I guess it's alright. As we're just talking. At the moment, this is my life. Abdulaziz M Alhamdan 30:57 Yes. And your heart is in Ukraine. So even though your body is in Milan, it's still there. So no problem. Thank you. It's my honor. My privilege, and I wish you I Alyona Zhyvkova 31:11 thank you so much for him. It was nice to hear you again.