Episode Transcript
Hello, my name is Aziz and I'm the son of a divorced mother.
She is really my superhero.
That's why it's important for me to support women to share their uniqueness, their personalities,
perspectives, and emotions about this world.
In these difficult times in human history, we need to bring the people of the world together.
And when we hear the voices of women, when we listen to real lives of women from other countries,
we connect our cultures without differences or stereotypes and we get inspired
by their stories to live a better life.
That's what this podcast is all about.
My guest today is Victoria Boychenko.
Victoria is an Erasmus Mundus Master Program Waves Scholarship winner from Ukraine,
now living in Gandia, Spain, and studying at UPV Polytechnic University of Valencia Campus,
Gandia. Victoria loves reading fantasy and psychology books, cooking,
dancing, and hanging out with her friends.
Now she's training with aerial gymnastics on the hoop, and earlier on she had tried ballroom
dancing, swimming, and kickboxing. Victoria had an experience with sewing clothes, corsets,
underwear, and medieval-style costumes. Her highest personal achievement
were getting a driving license after that, getting a scholarship to Erasmus Mundus,
and the next one is to finish it. Victoria, how are you today?
I'm great. Thank you for such a really great introduction.
I appreciate all the words here. Yeah, it's correct. I am all that to mention above.
I'm happy. I'm honored. I'm lucky to have you here. Very excited to know much more about you.
To begin with this, if your friends could describe your personality,
what would they say about you? I guess the first impression of all of my
friends is they would say that I'm really a nice person, and after that they would say
I'm really smart. Maybe I'm more introverted, but first description would be I'm really a nice
girl. I love that, and I want to discuss that first and further because a lot of people have
this idea that if you're a nice person you will get abused, that the world needs you to be
cruel, that if you're nice you will be abandoned, and that many people will take advantage of that.
So how do you stay a nice person even though there are those ideas that nice people suffer
in this world? I guess I also can suffer. I have bad days, I have bad mood, and sometimes I can
hurt people whom I love because my mood is not the best and my behavior doesn't let me be
the best person as I used to be that they call me nice. But I just stick to this
perception of the world that most people are trying to be nice and their first impression is
not to make you dislike you, just they want to be nice and they want to stay nice all the time.
You can find out that they are bad, that they do something
inappropriate and their behavior is abnormal or something like this, but the first impression
usually people are good, most people are good, and those exceptions that are highlighted in
social media, in our news, it doesn't reflect the reality. Most people are trying to be nice
and that's how I kind of manage to still be nice if something bad happens. I just try to
follow that I had a bad mood and I did that action, so if I feel after that that wasn't
like very right of me to do something to that person unfair, so of course I will apologize.
I understand fully and completely and then I wonder, after the full-scale invasion and the
war in Ukraine, how were you able to keep your positivity and your ability to be nice and
see the good in people? Because many could see the reality and the world as a dark place that
because of the war you begin to hate some people and all that, so how did you keep yourself
positive? I cannot be negative, like negativity is not that it's not part of my identity
and when I feel negative towards someone else, I feel bad inside of me that I don't like this
feeling of being in contradiction, like arguing with someone and even though I hate what Russians
do with Ukraine now, that they have started the war and they still continue to kill our people
and every day something bad happens and of course it hurts me a lot and my reaction is not to be
cruel to the whole world, I'm really furious only at one nation and that nation is Russia,
but I'm still a good person, I still try to be a good person, I don't try to
that Ukraine should be free, liberated from this war and win this war and it means that
I won't be able to make this war better if I just keep being angry at everybody else, so when
the war started I was just depressed, but being depressed doesn't mean to be angry at
everybody, so when I managed to get out of this constant state of depression I was just
trying to return myself back to be the person who liked doing all those amazing things that you
mentioned in the beginning, that I really like to do a lot of stuff that makes me better,
make me feel better and that's how I try to translate into the world that I can do this
stuff, I can be myself even though the war is going on in Ukraine. Thank you and I appreciate
your attitude and how you take care of your mental health and you mentioned the war, so
let's discuss that a little bit. February 24th, how was that day for you? Where were you
that day? How did you hear about the invasion? Did you believe it, not believe it?
And how did you change as a person from that day until today? On 24th of February I fell asleep
around one o'clock in the midnight because I was finishing my motivational letter to one of
my friends, I was in Boerka, it's not far from Kyiv, like 20-25 kilometers and my first thought
was, oh it must be some explosion like it was half a year ago when I met a man who had made
explosive in order to kill another one near his house, so I had this feeling, but after that I
heard another four explosions and I started searching more what is going on and I found out
that all telegram channels, chats are just screaming that the war has started, that Russia
invaded Ukraine and after that it was kind of frustration. I can say what I did all the day,
mainly it was just reading news because lack of information was so deep, it was like
scratched inside that I need to know what's going on, I cannot live in unknownness
because it's terrible, it was terrifying to be just doing nothing, you wanted to do something
and you can't because you feel empty inside and you keep scrolling all those news seeing
how many bombs have been trapped, like launched into other cities, other places, so
it felt like this is 24th of February. Thank you for sharing that and all I can say is
thank you Victoria and you mentioned that you were writing a motivation letter to
one of the Erasmus programs, why is this for you an important achievement, why did you choose
for example this specific program and that specific university, what did you hope to get
out of it and what is your idea, maybe there are girls who could do Erasmus but they're
very convinced so that they understand what motivated you about it?
The program that I'm in now, it's not the one that I wanted like the most, but
that's the one in which I got a scholarship and that's one that I was writing motivational
letters at night, it was for another program, it was named Intermass, it was more related to
bachelor background of applied mathematics, but fate is this that I'm studying acoustics now.
So this program Erasmus Mundus Waves I found on the last day of deadline on 31st of January,
it was literally like I started searching like at eight o'clock in the morning,
I found it, I understood that I have all the documents ready, I had motivational letter,
recommendations letters, I had all those CVs and so on, and I just needed to make my professors
to send those recommendation letter and I got them very quickly, like first in the morning,
second one was in the evening, but I managed to upload all of that and just for me it was
like a luck, a pure luck that I got into this program, but I found out about it just on the
literally on the last day, so it felt like luck, but I put a lot of efforts and I was just,
I had a goal to get into master degree abroad, to get opportunity to be in this Erasmus community,
as I heard so much from my bachelor university group mates, they just tried to and they had
such a great experience there as they shared, so they had a little bit switched mindset that I
really appreciated that they could share all those stories, they liked how they could compare
educational system in Ukraine and in another country, and that's what I wanted to, that I
wanted to see other people, I wanted to study something more specific than I could find in
rap specialty even in Europe, so we'll talk about in Ukraine. Of course we have some
like specializations, like in more audio system design or just for architecture, but
what I study it's more complex and we have specialization in each of universities, I study
now it's second and we study like different fields of acoustics, so
that's kind of what I like about this program. I love that and to ask you even further because
you are taking a lot of risks in life mainly because you're trying different things, you're
trying from kickboxing to creating costumes to now living in Spain, maybe there are women
in this world that because of the social isolation in the pandemic or social media
or anything like that, they feel stuck in their comfort zone, they don't feel confident to live
their potential on their dreams, what motivates you to live like outside your comfort zone more
and what is your advice to them so that they will follow and do the same and become leaders
in their lives? It's also a hard question because I'm still seeking of how to become a
leader of life. I purely understand that I may not be the best example to follow because I
have too many exciting hobbies which are really great to try, but they are really focused for
so different fields like sewing, kickboxing, reading books, also dancing and what I would
recommend to other people is to choose your focus area and to try to be more specific in
one direction. Even if you choose something creative, it's better to stick to this creative
You can have some small side hobby but it shouldn't be a lot of hobbies and that's
from what I kind of suffer sometimes. I just understand that I like the things I try,
I really enjoy what I do but it's hard to see a progress when you try to develop in
high intensity than be a small sound with multiple amount of small rays which move just
one centimeter per day. I love that metaphor, it's a very acoustic metaphor
and to ask you a bit further because you said your identity, you identify yourself as a good
person, a kind person, a positive person. Maybe we live in a time where many people
feel depressed, they feel very sad. How can someone develop their identity to see themselves in
positive light so that they don't identify with negativity and therefore
they help their brain think more positively, better, especially to women. Let's say some
problems happen and there are some women who they hear a lot of bad news like you said,
whether from Ukraine or all over the world, they feel sad because life may be like you had
a different erasmus, maybe another girl, she comes there and then she's sad every day.
Why didn't I go to the one I wanted? Why do I go to another one? So how to develop the
identity of being positive so that you keep your positivity and take care of your mental
health. I guess it's impossible to be always positive if you do not feel those negative
sides of life, otherwise you wouldn't have something to compare. If you live constantly
in a positive mood you kind of feel stuck in this state and you cannot feel the difference
when it's really much better positive or it's like a little deep or it's really really bad
situations that happen in your life. You mentioned about if when you see some bad news
or just something bad happen in your life and you got soaked in those bad thoughts,
it's good to acknowledge that you have these thoughts, you have to let your emotions to live.
But even for myself I do not allow to think for a long time in this direction of bad,
what's going on in bad, what's going on like if it's good, if it's something bad, for example
Today I found out that a train just arrived from one side of Ukraine to another and it was under
fire but it arrived on time and it arrived to the railway station from which I was
departing when I was seeking a refugee shelter in Czech Republic and it kind of triggered
me a lot because it's pretty terrifying and bad experience for me and I just got in this anxiety
state when you cannot even move, you cannot even answer and what helped me the most is just to
start talking to other people to ask tell me a good story, I just don't want to be in my
state of mind, I need someone to drag me out of there and if you feel that you cannot get out of
what you are in now, you are constantly in your bad thoughts and you cannot see any light of how
to make yourself think about something good, it's better to seek for help, for psychotherapy
help or another like psychology help to go to your friends to talk, at least try to use
someone else's help, you will not always be able to help yourself. Thank you, I love all the wisdom
and the insight that you're sharing and you had the experience now of living in Spain, how was
that adaptation to the culture and to the weather and to the food and to the people, was
it easy, was it a bit hard, are you immersed in the Spanish culture or because it's Erasmus you're
in an environment full of all the cultures and all the people, can you share someone,
let's say a girl from Ukraine or from her country who didn't go live abroad before and
she has the possibility to do it for study, for work or for Erasmus, what to expect,
is there a culture shock or it's not really the case? For sure, if you go to Spain and you
have never been there, but you are really excited to be there, you need to start learning language,
even simple phrases, even just how to get somewhere, you ask for a piece of apple in
the supermarket or just go to a post office and want to send a postcard to your friend,
you need to use your language and in Spain almost nobody speaks English, if you find someone who
speaks English you're really lucky, but even though they might speak English, they will not
have a high level, so basically my first advice is start learning language because I managed to
get some basics, it helped me a lot and made my experience much better, but you shouldn't stop
in this point, that's why three months after arriving here I'm not progressing in it, so
I feel like I'm a little bit detached of what's going on in Spain and how people interact with
each other, but I can say that I have a good experience here, I love educational systems that
I had one in Portugal, after that food is pretty good, even though it's kind of more expensive
than I had in Ukraine, in Portugal, but they have a wide variety, another thing that I found
pretty terrifying at first or maybe even amusing is dinner time and even lunch time,
for Ukraine it's usually common to have lunch at 12 1 pm, but for Spain they usually have lunch at
2 pm and dinner at 9 pm or even later, if you're invited for someone's dinner it's even good to
come at 10 pm, because that's when they have a dinner, it's really late and with current
lifestyle that I have in university that we go to lectures and we end our lectures at 2 pm,
so it's kind of easy to adapt to have such a late dinner, but at first it was kind of hard
about other stuff, I can say that I saw a lot in Spain, most of my time is pretty
condensed with studying, with preparing to assignments and lectures and just trying to
survive, because another aspect that might get a person who travels to another country
is loneliness, it's pretty hard to avoid, it's hard to deal with, but it's not something from
which you can die, but that's what makes this experience harder, that you have to survive
this state when you feel lonely, but with other people, with people from Spain,
from my group mates, it's easier and that's why I think my experience in India is pretty good.
Thank you so much, I really really love and enjoy and adore that, and to know you even
more, you spoke about your level of energy, you being someone who is multicultural but
very Ukrainian at the same time, what would you say is the attitude, the personality,
the culture of the younger Ukrainian girls, how are they different for example from girls in
Spain, how are they different in other parts, maybe some people never visited Ukraine,
especially after the war, if you could say a few words of course you can never
represent all of Ukrainian women, you need to talk so much in order to do that, but some
ideas about how you are different as a Ukrainian girl from other European girls and girls in
the world and what makes the younger generation of Ukraine special? The first thing that I might
notice at once that usually Ukrainians are taller, even Ukrainian girls are taller than
average girls and even men, so that was kind of my experience for first semester in Erasmus.
This one, second Erasmus in Spain, people are kind of average height as me, so it's not that
big difference, but still as I am tall and other people seem a little smaller, so that
kind of can be a difference. Second one, it's about food, Ukrainian food, I just had an
Ukrainian dinner party for my birthday recently and I had experience of organizing this dinner
and it was really a lot of fun to cook together, to share my culture with other people
and what I wanted to say is that for me it was a surprise that people do not leave
before 2 a.m. in the morning if they came to your party. I just had a tradition in my family that
if someone has a birthday and we have some celebration of it, usually it ends before
midnight, usually even at 11 people start to go home and here it didn't happen. I felt a
little bit surprised and I was tired of that, but that was the difference in culture that
I understood. People have different expectations when they have to end their dinner, to go to
home or when it's a dinner, so kind of like this. I'm not really sure if I'm answering
about cultural difference, but it's more about my personal experience. I'm pretty sure that
there are more differences that you can notice about being punctual, being concise in your
work, how you talk to your teachers and professors in the university, but I consider myself pretty
not shy, but not that talkative person at all, so I cannot say that I represent
majority of typical Ukrainian people, but in general it's still hard because globalization
works pretty well and you still see a lot of similarities, a lot of similar
features in each other's cultures, so I guess I still feel like it's a pretty
vague answer for this question. Thank you, Victoria. And to finish this, is there any
advice about life or wisdom or lesson you have learned that you try to remember for yourself
and maybe you can share it with other women so that they can live happier and better, anything
that you have you want to live more with and to remember more? I guess for now that was even
the first thought that appeared in my mind and the one that I already mentioned here is that
most people are nice and that's what I keep trying to remind myself when I fear to do something
that something might not happen to turn out good or I will have difficulties in finishing some
assignment and I will be punished, but usually people give you a second chance, they still try
to help you, they do not want to be in bad relationships with you, so my main advice
remember is that most people are nice. Thank you so much, Victoria. It was my privilege and
my honor to have you here today, to hear your voice, to share your perspective. It's absolutely
my own honor to spend this time with you and again all I can say is Slava Ukrainyi.
Hello, I am Slava and thank you for this wonderful podcast. I really enjoyed all this time
speaking with you, answering your questions and hearing your thoughts about what I say.
